20:20:22 <benzea> #startmeeting
20:20:22 <GNOMie> Meeting started Wed Mar  2 20:20:22 2016 UTC.  The chair is benzea. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:20:22 <GNOMie> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
20:20:34 <benzea> hi
20:21:07 <benzea> #nick moggi
20:21:33 <benzea> so, moggi is not going to be around this time and next week because he is still busy with his examinations
20:21:35 <benzea> hehe
20:21:58 * muelli is eating, so responses might have a bit of a delay -.-
20:22:22 <benzea> ok, I should increase the delay between changing topics a bit then? ;-)
20:22:33 <afranke> muelli, so even when you're not using a microphone, we're having issues communicating with you?
20:22:33 <benzea> #topic LinuxTag e.V. call
20:22:41 <benzea> woho! it has operator status!
20:22:47 <benzea> haha
20:22:47 <muelli> -.-
20:23:10 <muelli> na, the channel is not +t
20:23:13 <benzea> #info kittykat and benzea had a call with LinuxTag e.V. earlier today
20:23:28 <muelli> ah. interesting.
20:23:41 <benzea> and, everything looks good so far, we'll need some changes, the main thing still missing is that they haven't thought much about how much they need to charge us
20:23:52 <benzea> it actually seemed like they hadn't considered the issue zet
20:23:54 <benzea> yet
20:24:11 <muelli> so we've made them charge us? ;-)
20:24:39 <benzea> #info contract should be finalized by the mid of the month
20:25:02 <benzea> haha, well not having anything in the contract would be a bit weird too :)
20:25:49 <benzea> apparently they themselves pay in some way based on the income they have, but it might just be a fixed price for us
20:26:08 <benzea> they are dicussing internally
20:26:39 <benzea> other than that, we are writing Christoph Simon into the contract so that he can handle some of the interactions with them for us
20:26:57 <benzea> and, they'll provide invoice templates and such
20:27:22 <benzea> so, I think this is looking good overall at this point; there was no disagreement really
20:27:27 <benzea> any questions?
20:27:43 <muelli> nope
20:27:53 <benzea> cool
20:27:59 <benzea> #topic Code of Conduct
20:28:06 <benzea> apparently we should have one
20:28:20 <afranke> Says who?
20:28:26 <afranke> Just out of curiosity.
20:28:41 <muelli> "the Internet�"
20:28:46 <benzea> well, lets say it his way, I assume that someone will force us to make one if we don't have one :)
20:29:18 <afranke> Have you read the board minutes recently?
20:29:19 * benzea would like to preemptively put something in place
20:29:24 <benzea> nope
20:29:44 <afranke> https://wiki.gnome.org/FoundationBoard/Minutes/20160223
20:30:57 <benzea> hm, so the one for the mailinglists is supposed to be redone?
20:31:02 <benzea> how does that affect us?
20:31:02 <afranke> In the meantime (yesterday late in the evening), Federico accepted this task.
20:31:03 <muelli> so what do you suggest afranke?
20:31:15 <afranke> I don't really know.
20:31:17 <muelli> (assuming that you want to suggest smth by pointing to the minutes)
20:31:48 <benzea> afranke: it looks to me like anything that will come from that may be another couple of months
20:31:57 <afranke> True.
20:32:08 <benzea> so, I don't care :)
20:32:25 <afranke> We may point Federico to the ones you are putting in place though.
20:32:37 <benzea> sure
20:33:06 <benzea> anyways, the one that is on the webpage right now is one that allison drafted at some point, if people are fine with this, I would just put it up
20:33:36 <benzea> if not, then please suggest some other action
20:34:20 <benzea> i.e. suggest an alternative wording, or we need to decide not to have anything (which doesn't seem like a good idea to me as there is quite likely someone who will be pissed by that)
20:34:58 <muelli> I bet there will be at least someone who will be pissed no matter what you do ;-)
20:35:09 <benzea> sure
20:35:09 <muelli> so that's not necessarily a good way of making decisions.
20:35:27 <benzea> true
20:35:54 <benzea> but I also don't see any harm in a simple CoC that basically says "everyone be nice please"
20:36:32 <benzea> in the hope that it saves us some pain handling people complaining e.g. about not having any
20:37:06 <muelli> I don't a strong opinion in either direction.
20:37:07 <afranke> It is widely known that I don't think CoCs are at best useless, and probably more harmful than useful.
20:37:09 <afranke> BUT
20:37:16 <afranke> I'm not the organizer.
20:37:48 <afranke> And this one is way better than the one that was forced on me in SXB.
20:38:14 <afranke> So I think I can sum it up as "meh".
20:38:33 <benzea> hehe, expected that
20:38:51 <afranke> Yeah, I didn't expect anyone to be surprised. :)
20:39:07 <muelli> how about calling out on, say, guadec-list, for someone who cares..?
20:39:17 <benzea> tbh. I believe pretty much no one wants to discuss this
20:39:21 <benzea> muelli: do you think that is a good idea?
20:39:39 <benzea> it is one of those cases where the only one who cares is one who wants to push for an extreme position
20:39:42 <benzea> imho
20:39:58 <muelli> benzea: dunno. but it seems none of us three cares much. So my natural thing to do is to find someone who does...
20:40:11 <benzea> muelli: or just decide on this and be done with it ;-)
20:40:14 <muelli> s/three/four/ as Moira is here, too.
20:40:19 <sils> I think there will be people complaining if we have no CoC
20:40:25 * afranke suggests you take a decision and be done with it.
20:40:45 <afranke> sils, there will be people complaining in all cases.
20:41:07 * sils doesn't get the actual harm of a CoC, most people ignore it anyway, right?
20:41:19 <afranke> And that's supposed to be a good thing?
20:41:32 * sils is in another meeting at the same time and shouldn't be taken too seriously right now
20:41:46 * afranke thinks we shouldn't start digging into that hole.
20:42:01 <benzea> ok, how about this question (to anyone who is present). Do you want to use the CoC currently on the website (from desrt) for GUADEC 2016?
20:42:11 <benzea> answers are: yes/no/-
20:42:40 * benzea is for yes
20:42:46 * afranke abstains.
20:43:54 <benzea> muelli? sils?
20:44:34 <benzea> I'll ask dperpeet via e-mail about it, he didn't say anything though
20:44:55 * sils is for yes
20:45:14 <muelli> yeah, we're okay with it. but thinking that such a statement is needed.
20:45:36 <muelli> s/that/that it's sad that/
20:45:43 <benzea> fair enough
20:45:55 <benzea> do you want to tag that with info so that it shows up in the minutes? :)
20:46:32 <muelli> lemme try...
20:46:54 <muelli> #info we're okay with the current CoC, but think that it's sad that such a statement is needed.
20:46:59 <benzea> perfect
20:47:18 <muelli> oops
20:47:20 <benzea> #agreed we will use the current CoC for GUADEC 2016
20:47:31 <benzea> ok, yay
20:47:35 <benzea> that it out of the way then
20:47:50 <benzea> #topic Sponsors
20:48:01 <benzea> that is probably more for muelli and moira
20:48:15 <muelli> we've contacted six entities from that list since last time we've reported.
20:48:24 <muelli> I have SuSE to follow up with.
20:49:03 <muelli> currently, we're selling GUADEC sponsorship as a very good opportunity to get in touch with students or people otherwise interested in potential new jobs.  That claim, however, needs to be substantiated. With some ideas. That's where we want to brainstorm (aka make other people come up with ideas...)
20:49:46 <muelli> now is a bit bad, it seems. I guess sending an email to guadec-list might be good...
20:49:54 * afranke suspects muelli to be copy/pasting because that was way to fast for someone who's eating at the same time..
20:50:01 <benzea> haha
20:50:10 <benzea> well, I don't see much we can do
20:50:34 <muelli> Going crazy reg. ideas: Handing out registration data.
20:50:35 <benzea> I mean we can market GUADEC directly to students, which makes sense (e.g. banner on campus, telling people about the workshops, …)
20:50:47 <muelli> na.
20:50:59 <benzea> moggi had some ideas of doing some small foss talks
20:50:59 <muelli> I'm not after ideas to market GUADEC to students.
20:51:08 <benzea> no, but we can say what cool things we do for students
20:51:09 <muelli> rather to sell GUADEC as good opportunity to sponsors
20:51:20 <benzea> and that claim we reach them
20:51:48 <muelli> sure. I see that as a second line of action though. because it's quite unrelated to coming up with smth to do to make it interesting for sponsors.
20:52:04 <benzea> hmm, right
20:52:17 <muelli> ah. I forgot the info et al tags...
20:52:42 <muelli> #info contacted sponsors. no response so far. except.. suse and intel. following up..
20:53:01 <benzea> muelli: thanks for tagging
20:53:09 <muelli> #info now looking for ideas to substantiate the claim that we are good for companies to find talented students
20:53:41 <benzea> I think we want something nice, it is probably best to task the engagement people about it
20:54:04 <muelli> so you guys have to react a little... -.-   I mentioned "Handing out registration data" as an idea. To sponsors, obviously. Of our guests.. We don't do that!
20:54:59 <benzea> well, the usual scheme is that the sponsors will only get the data if they are able to scan the barcode, no?
20:55:16 <muelli> interesting idea indeed.
20:55:26 <muelli> i like!
20:55:41 <benzea> that way you circumvent most of the privacy issues
20:55:58 <benzea> you just need to make sure people know what data the sponsors get if you scan the badge
20:56:10 * muelli takes a note for later to have badges and barcodes.
20:57:48 <muelli> let me write an email to guadec-list asking for ideas, also bringing up the idea of handing out data just like that... hoping that it'll stir up some response.
20:58:17 <benzea> #info muelli is considering providing basic info about attendees to sponsors, benzea suggests that this may work within data protection laws if companies have to scan badges first
20:58:21 <benzea> sure
20:58:34 <muelli> ...
20:58:41 <benzea> muelli: could you include engagement-list if it is all about the student sales pitch?
20:58:45 <muelli> #info muelli considered that in order to provoke a discussion -.-
20:59:00 <benzea> you can do undo :)
20:59:04 <benzea> #undo
20:59:04 <GNOMie> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x2365bd0>
20:59:04 <benzea> #undo
20:59:04 <GNOMie> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x2365250>
20:59:07 <benzea> if you like that :)
20:59:09 <muelli> oha...
20:59:28 <afranke> <benzea> you just need to make sure people know what data the sponsors get if you scan the badge ← usually none
20:59:36 <muelli> benzea: ja. I'm a bit hesitant though. I mean... it's about extorting money from companies who might also be reading the lists.. But I can do.. let me try guadec list first, though.
20:59:39 <afranke> As in that's not something we have done in the past.
20:59:55 <muelli> afranke: doesn't matter for now.
21:00:05 <benzea> afranke: of course
21:00:06 <afranke> Even for the draw for Endless in Gothenburg, we didn't give them any info.
21:00:17 <muelli> it's about provinding the opportunities. it's not our fault if people don't visit the booths and are not interested...
21:00:17 <benzea> and you were never allowed to
21:01:18 <muelli> are we having more ideas coming..?
21:01:18 <benzea> I mean, in that scheme we basically "just" have a digital way of transfering a card instead of some paper slip
21:01:19 <afranke> benzea, well there was the question of how people signed in for the draw.
21:02:11 <benzea> afranke: but exactly the draw would be trivial with this
21:02:27 <afranke> Well it was trivial in Gothenburg in the end.
21:02:35 <benzea> endless collects the pseudonym for anyone who wants to take part (i.e. the barcode)
21:02:50 <benzea> and guadec can de-anonymise this person to them then
21:02:57 <afranke> puiterwijk added a feature to get a random attendee with the click of a button in regcfp.
21:03:00 <benzea> which seem clean from a data protection point of view
21:03:07 <afranke> So *we* did the draw for Endless.
21:03:11 <benzea> afranke: I know
21:03:16 <afranke> And Endless didn't care about getting any data.
21:03:22 <benzea> of course not
21:03:24 <afranke> They just wanted the publicity.
21:04:10 <benzea> all I am arguing is that a barcode system should be within data protection laws
21:04:34 <benzea> and I am actually not sure about the draw (soley because the person was announced publicly right away)
21:04:42 <muelli> lets... not talk about that.
21:04:52 <benzea> yeah
21:05:02 <benzea> moving on? any other comments with regard to the students sales pitch?
21:05:15 <muelli> or does afranke want to discuss the details of the draw out now?
21:05:33 <benzea> I think everyone here knows how it was done :)
21:06:18 <benzea> ok, moving on
21:06:40 <benzea> we should probably just make a decision on the sponsorship perks
21:06:45 <muelli> any other comment reg. sponsors or the students pitch?
21:07:18 <muelli> I take that as a no.
21:07:25 <muelli> #info we've contacted the tourism board and they've given contacts to other charities to ask for money...  and they will provide brochures (to be put into the bags) about what to do in BaWue. needs to be followed up.
21:07:26 <benzea> yep, I was assuming that already :)
21:07:40 <muelli> that's all for now.
21:07:46 <benzea> muelli: nice!
21:07:50 <benzea> that is great
21:08:10 <benzea> so, about perks; so far I assumed we just leave it the same as last year
21:08:30 <benzea> i.e. that bronze(?) gets a table, but lower ones don't, etc.
21:08:52 * benzea realizes he doesn't have the table anywhere right now
21:10:16 <muelli> it's probably incoherent. copy and paste et al... feel free to fix up.
21:10:29 <benzea> trying to
21:11:12 <benzea> http://benjamin.sipsolutions.net/perks.pdf
21:11:16 <benzea> hah, that should work for now
21:11:33 <benzea> tickets doesn't really make much sense, but they apparently had that in the broche last year even
21:12:09 <benzea> to be honest, we might as well just leave it the same
21:12:20 <muelli> for us with the local sponsorship, I expect everything to boil down to individual packages anyway.
21:12:27 <benzea> ah
21:13:05 <benzea> also, apparently someone was asking whether they could do on of the higher sponsorship levels but get a reduction for not putting up a table
21:13:17 <benzea> that does seem a bit weird to me personally
21:14:51 <afranke> Huh.
21:14:57 <benzea> ok, seems like no one has a real oppinion right now?
21:15:05 <afranke> Well it's weird indeed but
21:15:23 <afranke> Usually organizers try to accomodate the needs/desires of sponsors.
21:15:40 <afranke> Although it's difficult to do that and remain fair to all sponsors.
21:16:20 <benzea> right
21:16:25 <muelli> we certainly want to accommodate sponsors. and so far, I don't think we're hitting a limit yet reg. remaining fair to other sponsors ;-)
21:16:59 <benzea> well, I am a bit out with regard to the sponsorship and what is happening there
21:18:32 <benzea> hmm, silence
21:18:42 <benzea> muelli: I am fine with giving you guys a free hand in that regard
21:18:51 <benzea> muelli: but you'll need to talk to kittykat about it then
21:18:57 <afranke> +1
21:19:50 <benzea> muelli: there are also some other stuff, I think I'll write an e-mail about that
21:19:58 <benzea> which would finish this from my part
21:20:23 <benzea> muelli: anything that needs to be mentioned, some action items maybe? (there is the action command)
21:21:23 <muelli> colour me confused. there hasn't been a sponsorship request which asked for giving more money on our end ;-)
21:21:55 <benzea> hehe
21:22:09 <benzea> well, you get to be listed as e.g. gold sponsors on the website
21:22:15 <benzea> (no clue what level it was about)
21:22:18 <benzea> so that is worth something
21:23:17 <benzea> #action muelli to write to guadec-list/engagement-list about student sales pitch
21:23:55 * benzea assumes that there is nothing else to discuss then
21:24:19 <benzea> #topic CfP
21:24:55 <benzea> #info kittykat is putting together a paper team and will send out a CfP in about two weeks
21:24:59 <benzea> that is really all there is to it
21:25:10 <benzea> #topic workshops/keynotes
21:25:22 <benzea> should we discuss anything? there is nothing from my side right now
21:26:27 * benzea assumes that is a no then
21:26:31 <benzea> #topic misc
21:26:52 <benzea> #info moggi will also look into talking to hotels for non-sponsored people
21:27:08 <benzea> right, not sure why I put visa there again, it needs to be done, but it isn't urgent
21:27:32 <benzea> so unless someone steps up now about drafing something, I'll just push for later
21:27:41 <afranke> (Note: we're past the 1h bar already)
21:27:42 <benzea> anyone has something they want to discuss?
21:27:47 <benzea> oops :-/
21:27:53 <benzea> well, I think we can wrap up anyways
21:28:23 <benzea> muelli?
21:29:12 <benzea> ok, I take that as a no
21:29:15 <benzea> #endmeeting